I think a million would pay for things pretty nice. The duck has back taxesjrenney wrote:Hey, say if I give you guys a million dollars, think you could successfully implement FT?
hmmm... where's that paypal button again?
File Transfers Not Starting
It'll go on the wiki there, ya. Go to the documentation forums and see if anything is missing, and if so make a new thread explaining thingsmichael wrote:So is all the stuff from the Adium Documentation forum gonna go over there now as well? How is in-app help going also, I'll help out in any way I can if needed also.
I don't mean to add to the problem, but I wanted to just reiterate a point that has been made, although not as explicitly as I would like.
This lack of file transfer is NOT only affecting a small number of users. This is THE problem with Adium atm as far as the large majority of users are concerned. It's possible that it doesn't get as many feature-requests as it would be necessary to imply this fact, but I've talked to a LOT of people that don't use Adium specifically because of this lack of file sharing. The majority of the rest of the functionality is almost flawless, but this lack of file transfer leaves a gaping whole.
The arguments that it's only a small number of users, etc. are just naive, imo. The argument that there's not enough benefit considering the amount of necessary work, however, may be fair. But, by my estimation, adding NAT-circumnavigation should be the absolute TOP priority in the development of Adium. While there may be other issues, this one is the most salient, and the most crippling.
The new fancy file-transfer interface would be great if it was useful AT ALL to a HUGE percentage of your user base! With the proliferation of broadband, an enormous number of users are behind routers, and to the overwhelming majority of them, File Transfer is completely inaccessible in Adium.
I apologize if this seems inflammatory or simply redundant... but I felt like this point wasn't made explicitly enough with the obscure, unnecessary banter about the supposed incompetence/selfishness of the adium development team.
Also, I would like a bit of clarity as to the viability of adding this option. It seems like Adam is saying that it's possible, but not too difficult considering its lack of importance, but evands is implying that it's impossible, and many are blaming it solely on gaim. Is it not possible to separate the file transfer implementation from gaim and make it Adium-specific? This may just be my ignorance speaking.
It's likely that I'm misinterpreting, hence my desire for clarity.
Cheers
Mark[/b]
This lack of file transfer is NOT only affecting a small number of users. This is THE problem with Adium atm as far as the large majority of users are concerned. It's possible that it doesn't get as many feature-requests as it would be necessary to imply this fact, but I've talked to a LOT of people that don't use Adium specifically because of this lack of file sharing. The majority of the rest of the functionality is almost flawless, but this lack of file transfer leaves a gaping whole.
The arguments that it's only a small number of users, etc. are just naive, imo. The argument that there's not enough benefit considering the amount of necessary work, however, may be fair. But, by my estimation, adding NAT-circumnavigation should be the absolute TOP priority in the development of Adium. While there may be other issues, this one is the most salient, and the most crippling.
The new fancy file-transfer interface would be great if it was useful AT ALL to a HUGE percentage of your user base! With the proliferation of broadband, an enormous number of users are behind routers, and to the overwhelming majority of them, File Transfer is completely inaccessible in Adium.
I apologize if this seems inflammatory or simply redundant... but I felt like this point wasn't made explicitly enough with the obscure, unnecessary banter about the supposed incompetence/selfishness of the adium development team.
Also, I would like a bit of clarity as to the viability of adding this option. It seems like Adam is saying that it's possible, but not too difficult considering its lack of importance, but evands is implying that it's impossible, and many are blaming it solely on gaim. Is it not possible to separate the file transfer implementation from gaim and make it Adium-specific? This may just be my ignorance speaking.
It's likely that I'm misinterpreting, hence my desire for clarity.
Cheers
Mark[/b]
1) Adium features support for more than just AIM and instant messaging is about much more than file transfer.
2) AIM NAT Support will not fix Adium's file transfer. It will only address a specific problem caused by a specific network configuration on a specific protocol.
3) Demand and prioritization are dynamic and change over time as Adium's functionality is augmented and improved. Priorities and reasoning for not working on file transfer prior to 0.7 or 0.8 may no longer apply following these releases.
As I stated earlier: If you guys want file transfers to work over AIM when behind a NAT, send in a request. Get your friends who want to this feature to send in a request. Create a single, unified forum thread and post requests there as well. Better yet, direct these requests to the maintainers of the code responsible for this lack of functionality.
2) AIM NAT Support will not fix Adium's file transfer. It will only address a specific problem caused by a specific network configuration on a specific protocol.
3) Demand and prioritization are dynamic and change over time as Adium's functionality is augmented and improved. Priorities and reasoning for not working on file transfer prior to 0.7 or 0.8 may no longer apply following these releases.
As I stated earlier: If you guys want file transfers to work over AIM when behind a NAT, send in a request. Get your friends who want to this feature to send in a request. Create a single, unified forum thread and post requests there as well. Better yet, direct these requests to the maintainers of the code responsible for this lack of functionality.
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stayxtrue13
- Harmless
- Posts: 1
- Joined: Fri May 06, 2005 11:21 pm
I see that everyone is having problems sending files from behind a firewall... but is anyone else having problems sending/receiving files without a firewall? Ever since day one of me using Adium, I am yet to be able to use file transfer or direct connect. I can use file transfer on every other IM program out there, which is no surprise because I am not behind a firewall, so why not Adium?
I believe Adium has trouble if the other person is behind a firewall or NATstayxtrue13 wrote:I see that everyone is having problems sending files from behind a firewall... but is anyone else having problems sending/receiving files without a firewall? Ever since day one of me using Adium, I am yet to be able to use file transfer or direct connect. I can use file transfer on every other IM program out there, which is no surprise because I am not behind a firewall, so why not Adium?
Just to clarify on the previous couple posts...
The file transfer w/o firewall issue I have (and possibly stayxtrue13 as well) is the following scenerio:
Coworker using iChat within same subnet on same network, IP 10.1.2.105
Myself using AdiumX .81 at IP 10.1.2.109
File transfer just doesn't work. It will get so far as asking me if I want to receive the file, but not beyond that. Firewall on both computers is turned off.
Now, it is my understanding that because of the nature of AIM's OSCAR protocol (did I get that right?) that it won't recognize if two users are on the same network. It will still send the file out over the wonderful internet and back. Hence the firewall problem rearing it's ugly head again.
Am I correct in this understanding?
(PS: I know this is an issue with libgaim, not AdiumX... will other people please recognize this and stop bugging the Adium developers?)
The file transfer w/o firewall issue I have (and possibly stayxtrue13 as well) is the following scenerio:
Coworker using iChat within same subnet on same network, IP 10.1.2.105
Myself using AdiumX .81 at IP 10.1.2.109
File transfer just doesn't work. It will get so far as asking me if I want to receive the file, but not beyond that. Firewall on both computers is turned off.
Now, it is my understanding that because of the nature of AIM's OSCAR protocol (did I get that right?) that it won't recognize if two users are on the same network. It will still send the file out over the wonderful internet and back. Hence the firewall problem rearing it's ugly head again.
Am I correct in this understanding?
(PS: I know this is an issue with libgaim, not AdiumX... will other people please recognize this and stop bugging the Adium developers?)
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adamschneider
- Harmless
- Posts: 1
- Joined: Mon May 09, 2005 7:27 pm
Just throwing in one more end-user experience:
I have a router at home, but I've punched the necessary holes through it for instant messaging. My friend is also behind a router at her workplace (a university). I can receive files from her just fine, but I when I try to send them I get "Initiating file transfer..." forever.
For me, as for MarkE, this inability to send files is the primary (and perhaps the only thing) that's keeping me from using Adium on a regular basis.
I have a router at home, but I've punched the necessary holes through it for instant messaging. My friend is also behind a router at her workplace (a university). I can receive files from her just fine, but I when I try to send them I get "Initiating file transfer..." forever.
For me, as for MarkE, this inability to send files is the primary (and perhaps the only thing) that's keeping me from using Adium on a regular basis.
OK, I have only read the first page of this thred so if I say anything here that has already been said just call me lazy for not reading the other 5 or so pages.
This is my option on the subject and what I think most users are miffed about when it comes to file transfers and Adium.
Adam Iser-
Your choice of words to express the reason that Adium's file transfer is lacking are not the most appropriate ones. Let me go down the list...
a) File transfer is not the primary function of an IM client.
a-1) This is just your opinion. Rember you are making a program for the masses, not just yourself. If it was just for you then fine, this is valid. Stating this is like saying file transfer is a usless feature and i have no intention of ever making it work. This is something you do not want to convey to people that may donate to your project.
b) This only involves one of the many protocols supported by Adium.
b-1) OK, thats understandable. No problems here.
c) These changes are unnecessary for users (like me) who are in control of their router.
c-1) Again. Here is another line that basically says "this does not bother me so I dont care". You are not the only one using this software. Not everyone can control their router. You are basically saying "can't change your nat ports? Owell, TS.). This is not the attitude a software developer should have when you want some money for your work.
d) This involves changes to libgaim, not Adium.
d-1) BINGO! You could have just said that! Thats all, nothing else! Just say the code dosent support it, I would have to write alot from scratch so it will take alot of time. Nice, your not dumping on anyone and its a professional response.
e) These changes would help support and generate revenue for a company which is currently using Adium and Libgaim code in a commercial product.
e-1) How would this generate revenue? Its under the GPL the point of releasing stuff under the GPL is to help EVERYONE. Its the core reason for opensource. If you don't beleave in the core reason for opensource (it being a work of the internet comunity) then why are you doing this? Also if they are making stuff with your software how are they making money off of it? I do not know of a single GPL project that someone has turned into a flow of money.
Response D is the only one that had a shred of professionalism to it. The rest were mostly just opinions telling people that this dosen't bother me so tough. As for response E, just wow. If that is the case they you should stop working on Adium and never touch GPL code again.
evands-
Thank you for you for your response...
This is my option on the subject and what I think most users are miffed about when it comes to file transfers and Adium.
Adam Iser-
Your choice of words to express the reason that Adium's file transfer is lacking are not the most appropriate ones. Let me go down the list...
a) File transfer is not the primary function of an IM client.
a-1) This is just your opinion. Rember you are making a program for the masses, not just yourself. If it was just for you then fine, this is valid. Stating this is like saying file transfer is a usless feature and i have no intention of ever making it work. This is something you do not want to convey to people that may donate to your project.
b) This only involves one of the many protocols supported by Adium.
b-1) OK, thats understandable. No problems here.
c) These changes are unnecessary for users (like me) who are in control of their router.
c-1) Again. Here is another line that basically says "this does not bother me so I dont care". You are not the only one using this software. Not everyone can control their router. You are basically saying "can't change your nat ports? Owell, TS.). This is not the attitude a software developer should have when you want some money for your work.
d) This involves changes to libgaim, not Adium.
d-1) BINGO! You could have just said that! Thats all, nothing else! Just say the code dosent support it, I would have to write alot from scratch so it will take alot of time. Nice, your not dumping on anyone and its a professional response.
e) These changes would help support and generate revenue for a company which is currently using Adium and Libgaim code in a commercial product.
e-1) How would this generate revenue? Its under the GPL the point of releasing stuff under the GPL is to help EVERYONE. Its the core reason for opensource. If you don't beleave in the core reason for opensource (it being a work of the internet comunity) then why are you doing this? Also if they are making stuff with your software how are they making money off of it? I do not know of a single GPL project that someone has turned into a flow of money.
Response D is the only one that had a shred of professionalism to it. The rest were mostly just opinions telling people that this dosen't bother me so tough. As for response E, just wow. If that is the case they you should stop working on Adium and never touch GPL code again.
evands-
Thank you for you for your response...
I honstly did not know this. Now I fully understand why getting file transfer to work behind routers without port forwarding (either manually or via UPnP) would require a good deal of work. It does suck that it may be a wile befor I can use Adium full time but at least now I know some large hurdles have to be overcome befor NAT is not a problem.AIM runs a proxy server which serves as a middle man for file transfers. The official clients fall back on this proxy server when necessary to navigate firewalls and routers. We don't currently have that option.
Proteus is the application in question.necrosis wrote:e) These changes would help support and generate revenue for a company which is currently using Adium and Libgaim code in a commercial product.
e-1) How would this generate revenue? Its under the GPL the point of releasing stuff under the GPL is to help EVERYONE. Its the core reason for opensource. If you don't beleave in the core reason for opensource (it being a work of the internet comunity) then why are you doing this? Also if they are making stuff with your software how are they making money off of it? I do not know of a single GPL project that someone has turned into a flow of money.
Response D is the only one that had a shred of professionalism to it. The rest were mostly just opinions telling people that this dosen't bother me so tough. As for response E, just wow. If that is the case they you should stop working on Adium and never touch GPL code again.
Read the thread before posting please. You are lazy, and your laziness is wasting my time because I must reply to a post which brings up points that have already been covered. Your post is non-constructive because you did not read the thread before posting in it.necrosis wrote:OK, I have only read the first page of this thred so if I say anything here that has already been said just call me lazy for not reading the other 5 or so pages.
a) Way to go, I was posting my opinion. I am fully aware that people beside myself use this application. What I stated is not like saying that file transfer is useless. I never said I have no intention of making it work.
c) I never said that I do not care. I never said I was the only one using this software. I never said everyone can control their router. I am not saying that everyone should be able to change ports.
d) We've said that before, many times, over and over. The poster wanted more information, so I provided more information. I did not dump on anyone.
e) I said how it would generate revenue, read. A company is currently using the code in a commercial product. I never said that the point wasn't to help everyone. I never said that I do not believe in opensource.
Perhaps your should actually read the thread before reading-into the thread.
I am locking this, and if the non-constructive posts do not stop I will shut down this forum.